Post by Andorinha on Jan 14, 2009 17:11:12 GMT -6
AdvOf TB ARCHIVE: The Man On The Moon Came Down Too Soon
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Message 1 of 1 in Discussion From: MSN NicknameIarwainBen-adar1
Sent: 9/6/2002 1:39 AM
This poem and The Man On The Stayed Up Too Late are both credited to Bilbo Baggins. The historys attested by Tolkien when considering any of the sixteen verses in regards to Shire history are as we've seen patchy. Although Tolkien made attempts to fit these in as Middle Earth based writtings more often than not we have seen examples of Tolkien using what he had and altering it to fit within Ardas scope. This to me does not belittle his talent, but on the contrary opens a new and more personal understanding of Tolkien's life and thoughts. Take "The Sea Bell" for example: I had read and thought I had it all figured out with regards to Frodo's fading and along came Karo with a completely new outlook the supercedes the assumed view of the verse.
So what do we know of the the Man On the Moon?
Tilion (Q) Horned also referred to as Rana (Q) wanderer or wayward was one of the Maiar of Oromé who loved silver, his bow was even silver, and because of his love for this he was choosen to guide the last flower of Telperion acrossed the heavens.
So in comparison to Tilion how does Bilbo's Man in the Moon rate?
Well he lived in a silver sheen, had a silver beard, and was bejeweled with opals and pearls which could appear silver.
Tilions attire is not mentioned within "The Silmarillion's" Of The Sun and Moon.
In the poem he longs for ruby (red) sapphire (blue) and beryl (green usually). I add the colors here because I think he longs not for the gems, but the change of color.
This slightly contrary to Tilion as well as he begged the Valar to let him be the gaurdian of the silver flower. Although he was attracted to the gold flame of Arien (Sun) which caused him to be wayward in his travels accrossed the sky.
In the end of the poem it makes mention that "he arrived too soon" which might support the wayward tendencies of Tilion. But I suspect as Hobbit lore would go Bilbo would know the Elvish-Rana meant wayward but have little else to go on when it came to knowlege of Tilion himself.
So nothing really conclusive in regards to this poem being a representation of Tilion.
So enough of trying to support Tolkien's mythological histories, what are some facts behind this "lunatic quest"? (Tolkien liked puns) Well it was published in 1923 as to the exact dates I cannot be accurate because it seems that both TMotMcdts and TMotMsutl were both published within the same paper as one piece "The Cat and the Fiddle: A Nursery Rhyme undone and it's Scandalous Secret Unlocked" printed in Yorkshire Poetry, Leeds October-November it seemed to mark a happy time in Tolkein's life. I wonder if Glor's handy timline will jibe with that assumption? The paper was a whimsical fancy based on the seemingly nonsensical nursery rhyme:
Hey diddle diddle
The cat and the fiddle
The cow jumped over the moon
The little dog laughed to see such sport
And the dish ran away with the spoon
It was again published in June of 1923 in A Northern Venture A collection of the University of Leeds members prose. Later it was revised, and here I suspect broken into two poems or recreated into two stories for "Adventures" in 1962.
One thing we haven't touched on as yet is the illustrations of Pauline Baynes. This poem contains one of the larger pictures and although not my favorite, it is still a good example of her style that Tolkien was so fond of.
As for poem itself it's message is one of the grass is always greener or a fool and his money are soon parted, what do you think?
Namárië,
Iarwain
__________________________________________
Reply
Message 1 of 1 in Discussion From: MSN NicknameIarwainBen-adar1
Sent: 9/6/2002 1:39 AM
This poem and The Man On The Stayed Up Too Late are both credited to Bilbo Baggins. The historys attested by Tolkien when considering any of the sixteen verses in regards to Shire history are as we've seen patchy. Although Tolkien made attempts to fit these in as Middle Earth based writtings more often than not we have seen examples of Tolkien using what he had and altering it to fit within Ardas scope. This to me does not belittle his talent, but on the contrary opens a new and more personal understanding of Tolkien's life and thoughts. Take "The Sea Bell" for example: I had read and thought I had it all figured out with regards to Frodo's fading and along came Karo with a completely new outlook the supercedes the assumed view of the verse.
So what do we know of the the Man On the Moon?
Tilion (Q) Horned also referred to as Rana (Q) wanderer or wayward was one of the Maiar of Oromé who loved silver, his bow was even silver, and because of his love for this he was choosen to guide the last flower of Telperion acrossed the heavens.
So in comparison to Tilion how does Bilbo's Man in the Moon rate?
Well he lived in a silver sheen, had a silver beard, and was bejeweled with opals and pearls which could appear silver.
Tilions attire is not mentioned within "The Silmarillion's" Of The Sun and Moon.
In the poem he longs for ruby (red) sapphire (blue) and beryl (green usually). I add the colors here because I think he longs not for the gems, but the change of color.
This slightly contrary to Tilion as well as he begged the Valar to let him be the gaurdian of the silver flower. Although he was attracted to the gold flame of Arien (Sun) which caused him to be wayward in his travels accrossed the sky.
In the end of the poem it makes mention that "he arrived too soon" which might support the wayward tendencies of Tilion. But I suspect as Hobbit lore would go Bilbo would know the Elvish-Rana meant wayward but have little else to go on when it came to knowlege of Tilion himself.
So nothing really conclusive in regards to this poem being a representation of Tilion.
So enough of trying to support Tolkien's mythological histories, what are some facts behind this "lunatic quest"? (Tolkien liked puns) Well it was published in 1923 as to the exact dates I cannot be accurate because it seems that both TMotMcdts and TMotMsutl were both published within the same paper as one piece "The Cat and the Fiddle: A Nursery Rhyme undone and it's Scandalous Secret Unlocked" printed in Yorkshire Poetry, Leeds October-November it seemed to mark a happy time in Tolkein's life. I wonder if Glor's handy timline will jibe with that assumption? The paper was a whimsical fancy based on the seemingly nonsensical nursery rhyme:
Hey diddle diddle
The cat and the fiddle
The cow jumped over the moon
The little dog laughed to see such sport
And the dish ran away with the spoon
It was again published in June of 1923 in A Northern Venture A collection of the University of Leeds members prose. Later it was revised, and here I suspect broken into two poems or recreated into two stories for "Adventures" in 1962.
One thing we haven't touched on as yet is the illustrations of Pauline Baynes. This poem contains one of the larger pictures and although not my favorite, it is still a good example of her style that Tolkien was so fond of.
As for poem itself it's message is one of the grass is always greener or a fool and his money are soon parted, what do you think?
Namárië,
Iarwain