Wk14 Bk6 Ch9: Arrival in Valinor

[Stormrider]

From: Storrmrider (Original Message) Sent: 6/23/2003 10:25 PM

First Dawn of the Sun Copyright Ted Nasmith and Harper Collins All Rights Reserved	Gandalf and Frodo at the Grey Havens by Halfelven of TORN

And the ship went out into the High Sea and passed on into the West, until at last on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Tom Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a far green country under a swift sunrise.

How do you think Frodo felt with his first glimpse of Valinor? Was he dazzled? hopeful? excited? comforted?

Do you think that Frodo and Bilbo passed away to their final rest as they entered Valinor or were they really admitted to Valinor?

If they were admitted to Valinor, how do you think they passed their days there? Do you think they finally achieved peace?

Were they allowed to live forever there or do you think they eventually passed away?

While they were there, do you think there was a way that they could "look" on Middle-earth and see how things were going or was that something only allowed for Eru and the Valar?

[Stormrider]

From: Merlin the mad Sent: 6/24/2003 9:47 PM
The ring bearers lived in Valinor until each was ready to pass on. They need not die for some considerable time, as their bodies ceased to age in the way of mortals; but death must claim all men, which is the race that Hobbits are. Valinor is always aware of what occurs in Middle-earth, as I understand it. So if they wanted to see their friends left behind they could. (This perhaps would make Elrond's exile from his daughter Arwen easier to bear.) Their first glimpse of Valinor must have been like any weary traveler's homecoming to paradise: nothing could be finer. All emotions would be pitched to the maximum. Illness and weariness would flee away. Rest from all care and sorrow for the world would be banished to memory.

MtM

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From: Illadria Sent: 6/28/2003 6:49 PM
The Encylopedia of Arda says about mortals in Aman...

Tolkien is careful to point out, though, that even in Aman, mortals remain mortal.

However, I found no reference for that statement.

Here, then is what I have always thought about Frodo and Bilbo's passage into the West...

Enoch and Elias (Elijah) from the old testament, and Mary, Mother of God were "translated", or "assumed" into Heaven so that they would not taste death. Bilbo and Frodo's journey into Valinor is like that. It is indeed the fate of all mortals to die, but by Eru's grace some may not ever actually experience it. Aman is the Undying Lands. I believe that Bilbo and Frodo dwelt with the Elves and the Valar and Maiar in health and untold happiness until the Last song.

~Illy

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From: Galenas_ Sent: 6/29/2003 8:54 PM
Great analogy Illy.
I expect that the hobbits received some great measure of peace in Valinor. The damage the ring inflicted on them both was deep. Valinor was a place of great healing....think of the healing skill Elrond possessed....now think of it magnified. A haven it was.
I've always imagined Frodo entering Valinor with a great burden lifted from his shoulders.