Post by Stormrider on Jan 25, 2009 10:06:47 GMT -6
From: Lord_Algamesh (Original Message) Sent: 3/3/2003 1:27 AM
In the chapter entitled, "Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit", we are witness to Tolkien's use of comedy concerning the dinner scene which involves Sam and Gollum. It's a playful bit of banter involving two antagonists who make an attempt to work together to accomplish a task. I really can't imagine anyone reading this chapter and not uttering a chuckle as Sam "begs and bullies" for Gollums help in preparing dinner.
Considering the fact that the trio of Frodo, Sam, and Gollum have been together for some time at this point in the narrative, why did Tolkien choose this moment to devote so much time to the relationship of the two latter characters? Why did he choose this mode of presentation as opposed to possibly some more dramatic or mysterious encounter? Does this insertion of "light-hearted" interaction before a climatic event follow most other literature within the same genre? Are there any particular points to be made about this portion of the chapter?
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From: Alaere_Dûnhilien Sent: 3/3/2003 3:11 PM
Maybe, just maybe, I have an idea as to why Tolkien made this part lighter... Every time I read it, I always think that Sam and Gollum seem to be growing a tiny little bit closer to one another. Or I'll put it this way: suppose that they would have met in other circumstances, when Gollum hadn't been consumed by the Ring, then maybe, just maybe, Sam and Sméagol could have liked each other, even been friends. So we actually get a glimpse of what could have been.
In this particular part I always thought about Gollum as an animal that has been treated very badly, or even a young child that has been abused or something, and is just now starting to learn to trust someone again. Sam is rather friendly to him now, and Gollum does react to that, in his own way.
Actually, but this does not belong to this thread, Gollum is indeed regaining some of his dignity and former self by Frodo's treatment of him. Maybe, at this point in the story, Sam sees this too, though unwillingly maybe, and is somewhat caught off his guard, and therefor he gives Gollum a friendlier treatment.
These are only vague ideas, I haven't worked it out completely, but I must admit that I really love this scene, it always moves me...
Alaere
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From: Majah Sent: 3/4/2003 9:15 PM
i think the readers are to find this chapter bringing them hope that maybe that nasty ugly Gollum may actually be changing...gives us hope for the future of our hobbits?
and i think Sam and Gollum come together on the meal because it is for the well being of the one they both call Master...it is their respect for Frodo that gives them a common goal.
(and i sorta feel they are almost relieved that they can do this together?)
Majah
In the chapter entitled, "Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit", we are witness to Tolkien's use of comedy concerning the dinner scene which involves Sam and Gollum. It's a playful bit of banter involving two antagonists who make an attempt to work together to accomplish a task. I really can't imagine anyone reading this chapter and not uttering a chuckle as Sam "begs and bullies" for Gollums help in preparing dinner.
Considering the fact that the trio of Frodo, Sam, and Gollum have been together for some time at this point in the narrative, why did Tolkien choose this moment to devote so much time to the relationship of the two latter characters? Why did he choose this mode of presentation as opposed to possibly some more dramatic or mysterious encounter? Does this insertion of "light-hearted" interaction before a climatic event follow most other literature within the same genre? Are there any particular points to be made about this portion of the chapter?
* * *
From: Alaere_Dûnhilien Sent: 3/3/2003 3:11 PM
Maybe, just maybe, I have an idea as to why Tolkien made this part lighter... Every time I read it, I always think that Sam and Gollum seem to be growing a tiny little bit closer to one another. Or I'll put it this way: suppose that they would have met in other circumstances, when Gollum hadn't been consumed by the Ring, then maybe, just maybe, Sam and Sméagol could have liked each other, even been friends. So we actually get a glimpse of what could have been.
In this particular part I always thought about Gollum as an animal that has been treated very badly, or even a young child that has been abused or something, and is just now starting to learn to trust someone again. Sam is rather friendly to him now, and Gollum does react to that, in his own way.
Actually, but this does not belong to this thread, Gollum is indeed regaining some of his dignity and former self by Frodo's treatment of him. Maybe, at this point in the story, Sam sees this too, though unwillingly maybe, and is somewhat caught off his guard, and therefor he gives Gollum a friendlier treatment.
These are only vague ideas, I haven't worked it out completely, but I must admit that I really love this scene, it always moves me...
Alaere
* * *
From: Majah Sent: 3/4/2003 9:15 PM
i think the readers are to find this chapter bringing them hope that maybe that nasty ugly Gollum may actually be changing...gives us hope for the future of our hobbits?
and i think Sam and Gollum come together on the meal because it is for the well being of the one they both call Master...it is their respect for Frodo that gives them a common goal.
(and i sorta feel they are almost relieved that they can do this together?)
Majah