Wk. 3 Ch. 4 - High expectations

[Sparrow]

At the beginning of this chapter, Bilbo reminisces of the Shire. The narrator points out the contrast between Bilbo's and the dwarves' spirits as they said goodbye to Elrond and headed into the mountain, when, "Only Gandalf had shaken his head and said nothing." If Gandalf knew that what lay ahead was very different from what the company expected, why didn't he enlighten them? Wouldn't it be helpful for them to have a realistic picture of what to expect?

[jerseyshore]

I suppose Gandalf thought that they would find out soon enough that this was not going to be as easy as they anticipated. There was no reason to discourage them before they began, and chances are they wouldn't have listened anyway.

[Hilary]

There was no reason to discourage them before they began, and chances are they wouldn't have listened anyway.

I agree with jerseyshore...Gandalf was indeed wise. The dwarves would not be intimidated by the thought of what stuggles might lay before them. And poor Bilbo might just have turned tail and fled right back to the Shire!

[MajahTR]

i think telling them would have somehow altered the outcome?
i know i think and react differently to unannounced incidents...i am more decisive and strong. When i have too much time to think about the situation, i don't always make the right choice on how to handle it! i agonise over it too much!

that's one of the neatest things i find about Bilbo, even tho he is not happy with the course of this adventure, he seems to jump in and deal with the situations that arise quite admirably!
Maj

[Desi Baggins]

I think it is good to go into to something being positive instead of already being negative.

[Stormrider]

I always wondered how much thought the Dwarves had given their quest. My first thought would have been what would be needed to go up against a Dragon and how best to do that. Instead the Dwarves are just a small group with the burning desire to get their mountain and hoard back.

The addition of Bilbo as a burglar was not much more help! I would have worried that sneaking a burglar in to steal the hoard piece by piece would not have worked very well or quickly! Once they got it out, where would they have put it and how would they get it somewhere safe? What would they do with the Dragon after they got their hoard back?

They just went blindly into their quest without much of a plan and just trusted that it would all work out. That is real faith if you ask me!

[Andorinha]

Up late, can't sleep -- grumble. Hope this makes sense.

Hmmm, I'm not quite sure what ole Sparrow had in mind here. As I read her original question, I get the feeling that she is contrasting some sort of "good" mood on the parts of the Dwarves and Hobbit with Gandalf's more sober and somber appraisal of what is likely yet to come. But doesn't this situation actually come at the end of chapter Three, on midsummer's day when "... they rode away amid songs of farewell and good speed, with their hearts ready for more adventure..." (The Hobbit, chpt 3 A Short Rest, p. 53, last page of that chpt.)

When we get to chapter 4, Over Hill and Under Hill, (first two pages, 52-53 my edition) we get a sort of flashback to the brief feeling (Dwarves' and Bilbo's) that all will be OK, while, at that time, Gandalf was shaking his head, apparently thinking some grim thoughts about their chances of success. Just a few days after leaving Rivendell, once we are in chpt 4, it seems to me, ALL the company was now having second thoughts, and gloomy ones at that. Bilbo is daydreaming about the Shire, perhaps expressing some bit of regret at having left home, while "the others were thinking equally gloomy thoughts..." (pp. 52, 53)

So I get the feeling that ALL of them knew (pretty much from the day of the "party" at Bilbo's) just how desperate their mission was; but the joy of having been in Rivendell had lifted their spirits, momentarily. Once back on the road, back in the Wilds, they sober up quickly and become more realistically "gloomy."

Gandalf, it seems, even after a joyous sojourn in Rivendell, was still wise enough not to let the happy spirits of the place influence his own mood too much. Meanwhile, for that day of departure, why spoil the Dwarves and Bilbo's good mood, plenty of time for them to become somber on the next stretch of the road...

But, I like Stormrider's thought that: "They just went blindly into their quest without much of a plan and just trusted that it would all work out. That is real faith if you ask me!"

Maybe, because this was, after all, a children's adventure, it fits in with the target audience's mind set -- aren't children supposed to be impulsive, and don't they go running off into adventures before somberly thinking out the realities of the situation? Here, I guess, children can identify with Bilbo and the Dwarves who act, with a certain amount of blind trust in their future success, while Gandalf plays the wise adult, as does the voice of the narrator. Fairy Tales, for kids are supposed to teach valuable life-experience lessons, and Tolkien, as narrator, contrasts Gandalf's sober, adult mood with the initial "childlike" attitudes of the Dwarves and the Hobbit. Quite soon enough, without Gandalf's direct action, Bilbo and the Dwarves "sober-up" on their own, show signs of taking on a more adult-like responsible attitude...

[Stormrider]

The Dwarves knew how huge and menacing a dragon could be from their own experience in fleeing the mountain--at least the older Dwarves but maybe not the younger ones. Bilbo had never seen a dragon himself and while sitting back at Bag End that night during the singing and playing and planning, he had gotten into the spirit of the adventure and excitement. He was most likely more than a little curiious to experience what a dragon really was like. I am sure Smaug turned out more than Bilbo realized!

But having rested in a comfy place like Rivendell, I can see how thoughts of their quest would take a back burner so they could enjoy the atmosphere of Rivendell to its fullest. It sounds like it would be a place to bury worries and enjoy life.

Once back on the road and getting back into the travelling mode most likely brought back memories of their encounter with the trolls and then their focus back on their quest. I have to admit that they did have the drive and focus on where they were going and what they wanted to do. They might have been hoping they wouldn't end up in any more situations like the troll-situation and that they would get to The Lonely Mountain without incident. Planning for revenge could come later as they got much closer to their target!