Wk 6 Ch 8 The Necromancer

[Stormrider]

When Tolkien first wrote The Hobbit or told this tale to his children, was the Necromancer living in the southern area of Mirkwood? Or did Tolkien add the Necromancer to the story after he was trying to link it to The Silmarillion and LOTR?

Mirkwood forest in The Hobbit is a place that has grown evil, dark, and dangerous and even Beorn and his animals shy away from it and won't go in it if they can help it.

I believe it has turned dark and evil because of the Necromancer (which we all know is Sauron) being there. He is hiding out there and gaining his strength back.

Are the peoples of The Hobbit not remembering Sauron and, therefore, not connecting him to the Necromancer? Certainly the Wood Elves would remember the times of Sauron's reign and be attuned to who was living in the southern regions of their forest.

Even Gandalf had business in Dol Guldor 91 years before he set Bilbo up as the burglar (Unfinished Tales, The Quest for Erebor); and while there, found Thráin II and received the map and key from him.

Why wouldn't the Necromancer and his spies feel the presence of the Ring while Bilbo was in Mirkwood using it to free the Dwarves from the spiders and help them get out of the Elf King's halls? Was he too weak yet?

Bilbo had not yet mentioned his Ring to any of the Dwarves or Gandalf. If he had, I wonder if Gandalf would have suggested passing through Mirkwood! (Although Gandalf did not realize it was the one Ring until Frodo had it after doing research in the Library of Gondor.)

[Greenleaf]

According to LotR, Appendix B, Gandalf had found out that Sauron resided in Dol Guldur in 2850. Bilbo and the dwarves set out for their quest in 2941. That same year the White Council met. It seems that's where Gandalf went after he left Thorin's company at the eaves of Mirkwood. The White Council attacked Dol Guldur and it seems that Sauron wasn't strong enough yet to defend it because he abandoned it (having made his plans anyway). From what I understand the Battle of the Five Armies that happened in the same year must have taken place a little afterwards. So I suppose that Sauron left Dol Guldur while Bilbo and the dwarves were crossing Mirkwood or while they were travelling towards the Lonely Mountain. Sauron had already begun searching the Anduin for the Ring but it seems very reasonable that at the time he was preoccupied with the White Council's attack and wasn't looking out for the Ring.

What is not clear to me is whether the Wood-elves and Beorn knew that the Necromancer was Sauron or whether only the White Council was privy to this knowledge.

Of course, I'm not at all sure whether Tolkien had all this in mind when he wrote the Hobbit or even when he edited it to make it compatible to LotR.

[Stormrider]

Greenleaf:

While I was reading The Quest for Erebor in Unfinished Tales, I came across some information on where Sauron...err...the Necromancer was at this time in The Hobbit. It does corroborate what you stated above.

Gandalf had set up Thorin and Company and Bilbo with the task of working on getting their treasure and kingdom back and Gandalf also hoped that Smaug would somehow be destroyed in this quest. Gandalf did not wish for Sauron to solicite the aid of Smaug in his evil plots to get his Ring and control Middle-earth.

As soon as Thorin's quest had set out and was on its way, Gandalf set about persuading the White Council to attack Dol Guldor so that Sauron would not attack Lothlórien and Rivendell and wipe them out. When the White Council attacked Dol Guldor, Sauron fled and returned to Mordor.

This was a good move on the Council's part, because Frodo later would not have been able to hide out at either of those places and be able to escape the Black Riders or Moria orcs!

So that is why Bilbo was able to use the Ring to save the Dwarves from the spiders and rescue them from the Elven King's halls. Bilbo had the Ring on for long periods of time in the King's halls and if Sauron had been in Dol Guldor, he and his spies would have surely sensed it so near and have come for it!

[Stormrider]

I can't wait to see how Peter Jackson incorporates all of the timelines from Unfinished Tales and other HOME books into his movies!