Plagues in Middle Earth

[Stormrider]

Andorinha suggested looking up pandemics and diseases in Middle Earth for discussion. I thought that was a great idea, so found a couple of links to get us started. I'm going to read them before I make any comments.

tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Great_Plague

lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Great_Plague

[Stormrider]

Good references are listed at the bottom of the Tolkien Gateway link, too.

Gondor was hit hard by this plague. Dunland was ISOLATED and they weren't hit by it or at least not too hard. As it traveled North, northwest, it did hit The Shire and many hobbits died.

I wonder how the Elves faired during the plague? Especially since they are long lived. I think disease could harm them though.

[Stormrider]

Cardolan was hit hard and many of the Dunadain died in the Barrow Downs. I didn't remember who JRRT said the Barrow creatures were. I always thought they were evil entities and not the Dunadain.

[Stormrider]

From the first link:

The Plague was devastating in Gondor; Osgiliath was especially hit hard, suffering the highest casualties outside of Rhovanion. Many fled the city and removed to Ithilien and Anórien, and Minas Anor became the King's seat. The casualties were so high that the fortresses guarding Mordor were abandoned as the troops were recalled.

I wonder if this was when Sauron and the enemies of Mordor took over the fortresses guarding Mordor. Or did that come later?

ok, the 2nd link answered this question!

The casualties were so high that the fortresses guarding Mordor were abandoned as the troops were recalled. For the next two centuries Gondor, as well as its enemies, did little but try to regain strength. Eventually Gondor did recover and garrisoned the fortresses for a short time.

[Stormrider]

The 2nd link answered my question about the Barrow-downs:

The last of the Dúnedain of Cardolan died on the Barrowdowns, and evil spirits from Angmar and Rhudaur entered the realm.

[Stormrider]

I don't have the Battle for Middle-Earth !!: The Rise of the Witch King. It is at the bottom of the 2nd link and says that JRRT was working on changing the Plague to one created by the Witch King.

In Great Plague appears in The Battle for Middle-earth II: The Rise of the Witch-king., in which instead, the plague was a plan by the Witch-king to weaken the Dunedain kingdoms even further. The plague is created by Angmar's Sorcerers by corrupting the Barrow-downs of Cardolan, creating many Barrow-wights, including Karsh. Afterwards, the plague ravages Arnor, then spreads across the Misty Mountains, affecting Osgiliath, Rhovanion, and Rhun, presumably affecting them the same way as in the books.

[Andorinha]

Thanks for kicking this off, Stormy! Looking through the accounts of "real" history for models Tolkien could have been using. I'm thinking the Byzantium Great Plague of 541 might be the most appropriate -- has a great imperial capital (Constaninople) being hard hit, like Osgiliath in the Gondoran realm (an empire at the time of 1636 Third Age), rather than the better known Black Death plagues of 1300's Europe where even Rome was a largely abandoned place long before The Black Death struck, perhaps with no more than 20,000 inhabitants (down from its heyday under the Antonine emperors, circa AD 100, of nearly a million). Tolkien's classical education would certainly have made him familiar with Procopius, the Byzantine scholar who lived through this 541 AD plague and chronicled its course.

www.ancient.eu/article/782/justinians-plague-541-542-ce/

Back with more after I gather my Tolkien books.

[fanuidhol]

Apr 16, 2020 6:20:54 GMT -6 Stormrider said:

I don't have the Battle for Middle-Earth !!: The Rise of the Witch King. It is at the bottom of the 2nd link and says that JRRT was working on changing the Plague to one created by the Witch King.

In Great Plague appears in The Battle for Middle-earth II: The Rise of the Witch-king., in which instead, the plague was a plan by the Witch-king to weaken the Dunedain kingdoms even further. The plague is created by Angmar's Sorcerers by corrupting the Barrow-downs of Cardolan, creating many Barrow-wights, including Karsh. Afterwards, the plague ravages Arnor, then spreads across the Misty Mountains, affecting Osgiliath, Rhovanion, and Rhun, presumably affecting them the same way as in the books.

I am having trouble finding where you found that JRRT was planning to change the plague to the Witch-king's doing.
I have checked the pages in Peoples of Me, and Unfinished Tales. Neither of them reported this change that I could find. I looked at Letters, also, but the Index does not include Great Plague, Dark Plague or (plain old) Plague in the listings.

[Stormrider]

It is toward the bottom of the 2nd link I posted at the top. I found it easier on my laptop than on my cell phone. I quoted it from the Rise of the Witch King link.

Perhaps it is my interpretation of that quote that JRRT was working on changing his original plague to one engineered by the Witch King.

[fanuidhol]

Ok. I think I get it, now. The Battle of ME is a computer game.

[Stormrider]

Oh! Is it? I thought it was another HoME book! LOL! No wonder I didn't have that book! Duh!

[Fredeghar Wayfarer]

Apr 15, 2020 11:34:39 GMT -6 Stormrider said:

I wonder how the Elves faired during the plague? Especially since they are long lived. I think disease could harm them though.

I believe Tolkien said that Elves were not affected by disease. They could only die in battle, in accidents, or by surrendering their will to live.

As for the Barrow-wights, they were evil spirits that inhabited the dead bodies of the Dunedain of Cardolan. So not the Dunedain themselves but their reanimated corpses with someone else in the driver's seat, so to speak.

I don't remember if Tolkien stated the cause of the Great Plague. But it came from the East so it was at least implied that Sauron had created it.

Our own LOTRO gives the explanation that it was created by Lhaereth the Stained, a vampire servant of Sauron from the First Age. That's not canon to the books but I thought it was worth mentioning.