Wild Men

[McDLT]

What do we know about the Wild Men? They have always been a mystery to me.

[Andorinha]

McDLT: This topic is one I can get overly serious about, so I'll have to edit my thoughts on Tolkien and his sub-created "Wild Men" quite carefully before starting to post here -- be back soon.

[Desi Baggins]

Sounds juicey, can't wait!

[Stormrider]

Hmmm...whatever happened?! This looks like a topic that needs resurrection!

Robert Foster's says that Wild Men are Woses who are primitive men living in Druadan Forest during the War of the Ring. They had lived there since the 2nd Age. They hated and feared Sauron but did not oppose him openly.

In the 3rd Age, those nasty Rohirrim hunted them for sport! I am shocked! Actually, now that I think of it, I do remember something about this in ROTK.

Ghân-buri-Ghân was their chieftain and he led the Rohirrim through the forest to avoid an Orc army and reach the Pellenor Fields more quickly.

King Elessar officially gave them Druadan Forest and forbade any outsider to enter without the permission of the Woses. (Didn't the Woses forgive the Rohirrim and the Rohirrim promise not to hunt them for sport anymore?)

Robert Foster also said that the Woses were very handy with wood crafts and they used poisoned arrows.

I am going to dig out my Unfinished Tales because I think I remember something in the last chapters about the Wild Men but they were called by an elvish name that started with a D or Dr.

[Stormrider]

Unfinished Tales has more information:

The Wild Men, known as Woses, lived among the People of Haleth.

The People of Haleth were different than the other Atani and spoke their own language. They were allies of the Eldar and some of their people learned some Sindarin in order to communicate but spoke haltingly. They lived in woodlands and were skilled in forest warfare and many of their women were warriors. their chieftainess, Haleth, was an Amazon and had an all female bodyguard who she picked herself.

The Woses lived among the People of Haleth. They were very different from the People of Haleth. The People of Haleth called them drúg which was a word of their language.

The Elves thought that the drúg were not very pretty to look at: They were stumpy (no taller than 4ft high), broad with big butts and short, thick legs. They had wide faces with deep set eyes and heavy brows and flat noses. Their features were impassive and only their wide mouths and wary eye movements were the most expressive part of their faces. Their eyes [glow=red,2,300]glowed red[/glow] when they were angry. They had deep, gutteral voices and a really rich laugh that made everyone laugh when they heard it.

There is more but I have to head to work. I will post more later.

[Stormrider]

You would not want the Wild Men as your enemy. Once they became angry, their wrath did not cool quickly. They did not show their anger except for the red light in their eyes and they fought in silence. They did not make a big show of victory either—even over Orcs who were their worst enemy. The Orcs loved to capture them and torture them.

The Eldar named them Drúedain (there is the Elvish name I mentioned above and could not quite remember). They lived in Ered Nimrais (later called the White Mountains) and the Forest of Brethil between the rivers Teiglin and Sirion in Beleriand in the First Age.

The Drúedain were very much loved and were very helpful to those they lived among and highly sought after. They were skilled at tracking all living creatures. They used their scent and keen eyesight for tracking. The had a large knowledge of growing things (almost equal to the Elves).

They did not have any form of writing until they met the Eldar. But still they only developed a very small number of signs that were very simple--just enough to mark trails or give warning.

They used flint for scraping and cutting. Metals were hard to come by in the early ages and forged weapons and tools were expensive. So they developed their skill of carving in wood and stone for their weapons and tools. Their knowledge of plants provided them with what pigments they needed for painted and decorating.

They carved figures of people and animals and Wild Men as toys and large figures. These were very strange and life-like and could even be terrifying. They made Orc figures shaped as if fleeing and set them along the borders of their lands to scare the Orcs from entering. Also they made figures of themselves which they called ‘watch-stones’. Many of the figures of Drúadan were created as if squatting on a dead Orc! The Orcs called the Drúedain ‘Oghor-hai’ and thought that the figures were filled with the malice of their creators and would not touch them or travel past them.

The Drúedain could sit for days on end with their legs crossed, hands on knees or laps, eyes closed or looking at the ground. This is how they would sit hidden in shadow while they were on guard. Even if they were not seen, they would emit a hostile aura to any intruders who came near. If an evil thing came near, they would give a shrill whistle warning. The Folk of Haleth held the Drúedain guards in high esteem and believed that the Drúedain had magical powers.

There is more and I will post that in a little while.

[Andorinha]

Excellent material, Stormrider!!

Wow, you're right, this topic sort got of lost. I remember writing up at least an outline for some discussion here, and I'll see if I can find it, flesh it out -- but you are doing a great job of researching this issue, looking forward to reading more!

[Desi Baggins]

Wow, they really sound like someone you don't want to upset! I never really got that from LOTR. I felt they were just the type that kept to themselves, but not really the type that was feared so much. I thought the caution in LOTR was due to just not knowing or understanding them. The fact that their eye glowed red and they put off a hostile aura sounds creepy!

[Stormrider]

In LOTR, Ghan Buri Ghan and his people seem more like aborigines without any special powers and just wanted to be left alone. After reading the chapter on them from UT, it gives us more interesting info about them.

I also believe there was another race of people called Wild Men, too. PJ used them in TTT movie as part of Saruman's army to attack a small village in Rohan where the mom puts her two kids on a horse to ride to Edoras and alert them. I think that JRRT also called them Wild Men at some point. I can't remember where I saw that. I should try to find that somewhere.

[Andorinha]

Hmmm, can't recall JRRT ever calling the Dunlendings "Wild Men," maybe that name was used in the movies? Anybody else know?

[Stormrider]

I found something in UT referring to other Men as Wild Men. This is in the "History of Galadriel and Celeborn" chapter:

More ominous were rumours from the further East: the Wild Men were restless. Former servants and worshippers of Sauron, they were released now from his tyranny, but not from the evil and darkness that he had set in their hearts. Cruel wars raged among them, from which some were withdrawing westward, with minds filled with hatred, regarding all that dwelt in the West as enemies to be slain and plundered.

OK. This is kind of obscure. It doesn't specifically say they were the Dunlendings. I'll keep looking to see if there is anything more specific. I need to find something more on the history of the Rohirrim, I think, in order to find what I'm looking for. The feud between the Rohirrim and the Dunlendings, perhaps.

[Andorinha]

Excellent research, Stormrider! This at least allows us to extend the use of the term "Wild" to men of more than just the race of the Druedain, but as you point out, it does not yet put the Dunlendings into that category. I wonder if only the "eastern" tribes of Men are "wild?" The Dunlendings lived along the mountain slopes of Calenardhon before it was ceded to the Rohirrim under Eorl the Young. Maybe some Dunlendings also lived further east, maybe even east of the Great River?

Again, maybe they lived only along the mountain chains, The southern Misty Mountains, and then south and west along both sides of the White Mountains as the folk who became the betrayers of Isildur, those who were cursed and turned into the ghosts who guarded the Paths of the Dead?

Isn't there an HOME volume that details the races and peoples of Middle-earth? Maybe that text would have more information on the Dunlendings?

[Stormrider]

Excellent idea! Peoples of Middle Earth is the HOME book that I need. I will check it out. This is one of the HOME books that I have yet to read completely. It probably has a lot of interesting information in it!

[fanuidhol]

I'm finishing up my annual read of LotR. Last night, while reading Appendix A, I came upon some pertinent information.

Under (iv) 'Gondor and the Heirs of Anarion' the 2nd paragraph mentions wild men (non capitalized) and seems to associate them with Easterlings.

Further in this section, under the sub-topic, 'The Stewards', during Cirion's rule, a people called Balchoth lived in Rhovanion. Supplemented by other tribes, the Balchoth attacked across the Anduin. This is when the Rhohirrim came for the first time to save the day. The Balchoth were wiped out.
The same battle is seen through the Section II of Appendix A: 'The House of Eorl'. In the year 2510, a "great host of wild men from the North-east swept over Rhovanion..."

The funny thing is, in all the times I've read Appendix A, this is the first time I noticed these people called Balchoth!!!
Fan

[Stormrider]

Fan: I haven't been successful in tying the Dunlendings to the name Wild Men yet. I'm reading the Cirion and Eorl chapter of UT and I see the reference to the Balchoth, too. I had not heard that name before, either.

Andorinha: Robert Foster's Complete Guide of Middle-Earth states that the Dunlendings were divided into several groups. He also states that the Dunlendings had inhabited the valleys of the Ered Nimrais at one time as well as Dunland which was west of the Misty Mountains and south of the Glanduin.

1. Some mixed in with the people of Gondor

2. One group became the Dead Men of Dunharrow

3. Some moved north--The Men of Bree were the northern most tsurviving branch during the time of the War of the Ring.

4. Some settled in Dunland--These were the people that hated the Rohirrim. They were tall and swarthy, kept their ancient language, were primitive, uncultured, and superstitious. Perhaps this is where I came by the idea that they had been called Wildmen as well as the Woses.

5. Some moved into Eriador